Empty Promises

New Library: Bait-&-Switch?

Editor's Note: Articles written by citizens reflect their own opinions and not the views of the Winter Park Voice.  

Empty Promises

Guest Columnist Peter Knowles Gottfried

Have you ever gone to a car dealership to investigate an incredibly good deal only to realize the “deal” really is too good to be true? Or perhaps you were enticed by an ad for a condo with water view only to find that “water” was a retention pond. This is how folks who voted for the proposed “Library-Event Center” must be feeling.

We were promised a beautiful 50,000 square foot Library and new Event Center at the corner of Harper Avenue and Morse Boulevard overlooking Lake Mendsen. We also voted for a parking structure that would adequately service both the new library and the event center. And finally, City literature told us, “The new library, event center and garage footprint will require less than 1percent of additional open space” within Martin Luther King, Jr. Park.

As it develops, however, the situation becomes more and more like being the customer at the car dealership anticipating a shiny new Highlander and being offered a used Yaris instead.

The 50,000 Square Foot Promise.

Let’s begin with the library campaign to win voter approval for a $30 million bond issue for the demolition of the existing Civic Center and the construction of the new library-event center and parking structure. Just about every piece of literature sent to voters spoke of the need for more library space, overcrowding in the youth section and insufficient computer lab space.

One election mailer asked, “What do you do when Winter Park’s Library … has to remove children’s books, even favorites, every time a new book arrives? …doesn’t have enough computers or digital labs? …can’t accommodate emergency rescue equipment above the first floor? …has no space for after-school tutoring rooms?”

Another mailer claimed, “Our children continue to lose out on learning opportunities and materials because of inadequate space.”

Grandma Promise

Grandparents, seniors, and adults will get “fully equipped technology labs with classes for seniors, students and entrepreneurs.” Another mailer promised, “Expanded and climate-controlled history center with exhibit space, genealogy lab and digitization to preserve our shared history.”

It is no wonder that the Library Board, the Commission and Citizens were excited about a new 50,000 square foot library. A letter from the then President of the Winter Park Library Board of Trustees to voters stated that the library would provide early childhood literacy areas, tutoring rooms, digital media labs, make the library safer, and provide for a new parking facility.

Where Did We Get 50,000 Sq.Ft?

Where did the “50,000-square-foot” number for the library appear? The Library Task Force, a committee authorized by the City Commission to come up with recommendations for the new library, stated in their final report that the estimated size of the library was 50,000 square feet, with the existing library at 33,742 square feet. We were getting an additional 16,206 square feet, a significant increase by any measure.

Following that, an email blast from the “yes for winter park library” Political Action Committee (PAC) clearly stated the proposed library was to be 50,000 square feet. That same email stated there would also be a one-story, 220-space parking deck.

The Winter Park Library staff sent an email to “Friends, Neighbors and Patrons” stating that the library will be 50,000 square feet and include a one-story parking deck for 220 cars. And finally, the City issued a Request for Qualifications for Library Design Consultant Services which clearly stated that the project will include “a new 240-space (sic) parking garage, a new 50,000 square foot library . . . .”

Honey, They Shrunk the Library

It must be a disappointment to the Library friends, neighbors and patrons to find that the new library will be barely larger than the existing library. Depending on whose numbers you use, we may be getting 867 or 991 additional square feet for a new library that everyone thought would provide significantly more space. The architect says the new library will be 34,661 square feet. Pizutti, the City’s program manager, says 34,785 square feet.

Parking Structure Promise

The reference to a parking structure is in the ballot language. The ballot clearly stated that $30 million in general obligation bonds were to be issued for the “purpose of financing the Winter Park Library and Event Center to include library facilities, civic meeting and gathering facilities and related parking structure, and improvements….” [emphasis added]

The City website shows the new plans for a library-event center with surface lots spread throughout MLK Park, including parking spaces at the community playground off Denning Drive.

Certificate Concerning Official Statement

On June 1, 2017 Mayor Steve Leary, City Manager Randy Knight and Finance Director Wes Hamil signed the Certificate Concerning Official Statement attesting to the truthfulness of statements made in the May 8, 2017 Bond Resolution.

The execution and delivery of this Official Statement has been duly authorized and approved by the City. At the time of delivery of the Bonds, the City will furnish a certificate to the effect that nothing has come to its attention which would lead to believe that the Official Statement as of its date and as of delivery of the Bonds, contains an untrue statement of a material fact or omits to state a material fact which should be included herein for the purpose for which the Official Statement is intended to be used, or which is necessary to make the statements contained herein, in light of the circumstances under which they were made, not misleading.”

Wikipedia defines parking structure as, “A parking garage also called a multistory, parking structure, parking ramp, parking building, parking deck or indoor parking, a building designed for car parking . . . .”

Now the Commission has decided that a series of surface lots will take the place of the parking structure called for on the ballot. How might the Municipal Securities Rulemaking Board regard some of these directives by the Commission regarding the new Library and Event Center?

Footprint-Will-Use-Less-Than-1-Percent-of Park-Land Promise

One of the documents circulated by the City and the Winter Park Library included a page that stated, “The total area of the new library, civic center, and garage “footprint” will require less than 1 percent of additional open space above the area where the existing parking lot and Civic Center now exist.”

A review of the site plan for the new library-event center and parking shows considerably more space taken than the 1 percent promised. In fact, the new facility is approximately 15 percent of the total MLK Park’s 26.8 acres, or about 8 percent of the total park in excess of the footprint of the existing Civic Center. Eight percent is significantly more green space lost than the 1 percent promised.

Footprint of New Library/Event Center and Surface Parking.

Shortly after voters approved the library/event center in the spring of 2016, a lawsuit was filed challenging the proposed location at MLK Park. No location had been specified in the ballot language.

The Judge in that case ruled that the ancillary documents provided prior to the election – mailers from the Library PAC, emails from the City, Library web pages and presentations by various committees — would lead a reasonable person to conclude that the library was to be built at MLK Park.

The same reasoning can be applied now. The voting public can reasonably conclude the City will build a 50,000 square foot library and event center, and an associated parking structure.

Winter Park voters have the right to question these un-kept promises and to decide if they are happy with the outcome. You can let your elected representatives know they might have some explaining to do by writing them at mayorandcommissioners@cityofwinterpark.org

Peter Knowles Gottfried is an environmental scientist who drew up one of the first plans for Martin Luther King, Jr. Park in 1985. He was a Winter Park Commissioner 1986 to 1996, and then served on the Planning & Zoning Commission from 2011 to 2017.

  • author's avatar

    By: Anne Mooney

    Anne Mooney has assumed the editorship of the Winter Park Voice from founding editor Tom Childers.

    Mooney got her start in New York as a freelance line editor for book publishers, among them Simon & Schuster and the Clarkson Potter division of Crown Books. From New York, she and her husband and their year-old toddler moved to Washington, D.C., where the two ran a newswire service for Harper’s magazine. “We called it Network News,” said Mooney, “because it was a network of the Harper’s writers, whose work we edited into newspaper style and format and sold to papers in the top U.S. and Canadian markets. We were sort of like a tiny UPI.”

    The newswire ceased operation with the death of Mooney’s first husband, but Mooney continued to write and edit, doing freelance work for Williams Sonoma cookbooks and for local publications in D.C.

    In 2005, Mooney moved to Winter Park, where she worked as a personal chef and wrote a regular food column for a south Florida magazine. She took an active interest in Winter Park politics and was there when the Winter Park Voice was founded. She wrote occasional pieces for the Voice, including the Childers bio that this piece replaces.

    The Winter Park Voice is one of a large number of “hyper-local” publications that have sprung up across the U.S. in response to the decline of the major daily newspapers and the resulting deficit of local news coverage. The Voice’sbeat is Winter Park City Hall, and its purpose is to help the residents of our city better understand the political forces that shape our daily lives.

  • author's avatar

30 replies
  1. Used 1967 Datsun (enter from passenger side) says:

    What a civics lesson this has been?!! My questions: What have we paid the design architect (Adjaye) to date of his promised $1.7 million fee? More importantly, what have we gotten? Why have citizens lost considerable green space from one of our primary parks w/ no adequate compensation in the downtown core?Why do we still have no parks masterplan. What is it with Winter PARK: our city leaders hate having to view open green space? There is an election in March 2019. Can’t wait for my ballot.

    Reply
  2. John Skolfield says:

    This facility will cost a fortune, experience cost overruns and have a ton of critics. It likely won’t enhance my life a great deal and will cost me a chunk in taxes as I own many properties in Winter Park.

    I’m all for it! Everything isn’t about my life, sometimes its about reaching out to our fellow humans so that those of use who are living the good life can offer a hand out.

    Go by the $7M community center and observe many less privileged kids in a safe pleasant space working hard on their homework, exercising, socializing and elevating their place in society.

    John

    Reply
    • West Side Pirate I Am Not says:

      I haven’t found anyone yet who supports the new library who won’t make a lot of money personally from the gentrification of the west side.

      Reply
    • KIG says:

      Excuse me, as a member of a city advisory board that allocates funds to downtown homeowners, didn’t you recently ask for and receive a large sum of money to improve a downtown property you own that sits squarely in the Park Avenue District of Million dollar properties?

      Reply
    • Concerned Citizen says:

      John, wouldn’t it be honest here for you to disclose the recent financial benefit you willingly took to rebuild a porch on your historic downtown offices. So please correct me if I’m wrong. You sit on the advisory board that allocates $$ in the district where you own property. Then at a meeting you requested funding for your personal business, and while you recused yourself from voting, the optics still look pretty bad.

      Skolfied Homes not only built the porch gratis CRA money, but you also took home a tidy profit.

      Welcome to the club of developers who cash-in on our tax dollars..so now you’re promoting that library that benefits YOUR West Side properties???

      hmmmm

      Reply
  3. Mr. Kiamoto says:

    “Bait and Switch” has been the Winter Park way forever. It usually works, because too many of our residents don’t have the time or interest to follow what’s really happening with our City Commission. If one can remember back about a decade, we had a huge fiasco called “The Carlisle,” a massive condo development proposed to overlook Central Park. Every time the developers came before the Commission, they had more changes and more demands. As the campaigns of most of the Commissioners had received heavy contributions from these developers, their “Bait and Switch” tactics were continually approved. That is, until the public finally became aware of what was going on. A new slate of Commissioners was subsequently elected and the City paid the developers over a million dollars to get out of a deal approved by the previous Commission. “Bait and Switch” – it’s the Winter Park way, until ……

    Reply
  4. Randy Vance says:

    Peter, that’s an excellent synopsis of the sleight of hand our city has been offered but you miss yet another point only hinted at in last month’s Commission chambers.

    First, the city manager tendered the first three change orders to the contract. One was for a rooftop cafe, one was for inclining the auditorium floor and one was for a portico so cars could drive up and discharge passengers out of the rain. $3 million all told. The portico was approved. Wait? What? We didn’t have the auditorium floor inclined? That sounds exactly like the old building. This is just the first round of change orders.

    Here’s the biggie and it was foreshadowed by a “toss off” remark by one of the project representatives. “We got the soil report back and there are problems.” The subject was immediately changed. So, when they get done mitigating the soil problems by driving pilings that weren’t planned for in the original proposal, how much will this fiasco really cost?

    Reply
  5. Scratching my Head says:

    I appreciate Peter’s thoughtful analysis of the upside down library project and he lays out a good argument of residents being screwed by ambitious library board members seeking status, financial gain, power and new clientele….among other things.

    Peter’s opinion begs the question, why in the world did you publicly support the current mayor whose proven record shows he’s a tool for special interests, with no better example than his push for this library boondoggle damaging park space, a mayor who deliberately deceived voters on the location, a politician who cashed in on insider governmental knowledge, creating a shell company to deliberately hide a land purchase that stood to gain from his own vote, and a mayor who has shown favoritism to a short list of nefarious characters, some with questionable pasts, giving them all sorts of favors for inappropriate build.

    You lost me there.

    Reply
  6. Follow the Muck says:

    Time to ask for a lifeline–this project is literally sinking. Commissioners could have followed a simple best practice: qualify the site, THEN design. They did not by choice–as voiced repeatedly. Not a one-off. The proposed site on the NW corner of MLK Park is compromised–pockets of organic soils (muck), construction debris (noted in prior years press accounts), and unstable soils will necessitate more costly foundation support. Why are we learning this NOW? The site floods. We’ve all seen it: whitecaps on Morse; TV crews reporting from Morse and Harper. This could be addressed upfront. It was not. Lake Mendsen is at stormwater capacity before a single shovel of dirt will have been turned. New library sf net over existing facility–approx 1200 sq–and with an unstable site to contend with–those library book late fees could escalate to $25/PER day. Wonder what engineering books are on the shelves–perhaps the commissioners should check them out–“Driving Piles Leads to Project Cost Overruns–An Elected Officials’ Memoir”

    Reply
  7. Tomas J. MacDonnall says:

    The emphasis is on the wrong objective for this $34 Million expenditure. We will all pay; yet it is being designed to help only a few. I encourage those in power to do the right thing and make this a “World Class Leaning Center” for all citizens; not a place for the “Rich and Connected” to socialize.

    Reply
  8. Maggie DeVane says:

    Mr. Gottfried’s letter is well researched and troubling. How can we move forward to address these real concerns with the city? It seems they are in breach of the Certificate of Official Statement.

    The article’s comments contain several serious issues:

    * Soil report corrections and possible pilings can cost millions of dollars.
    * If true, fraudulent insider trading, shell companies, and trickery are nothing new in our town, but still illegal.
    * And, my original concern with this whole redevelopment: $30 million could buy 100 books, a computer, and 5 years of broadband for every household in the city.

    Let’s call it what it is: a citizen tax for a profit-making event center. We deserve to have the basic promises about the project’s size, imprint on green space, and parking made correct before groundbreaking, as approved by voters. It is already impossible to park in the provided lot and parking structure at Lakeside Crossing without using the Murrah Center lot.

    Reply
  9. The Last Change Order says:

    Don’t worry, Peter.

    By the time all the change orders are in, it will be a 999 sq. ft. library and 666 “learning focused” apartments.

    Each resident will receive a full color, glossy brochure from the City explaining the “need” for people to be “close” to their library, hence the “need” to make apartments part of the “canopy” change order.

    It will go on to explain that the library will continue to keep their “old fashioned” book collection, but that books will not be needed in the new library. Instead, residents who wish to access books will be directed to a non-descript warehouse on the outskirts of town where the library books will be stacked in storage crates for them to sift through.

    The “modern” new 999 sq. ft. Winter Park library, the brochure will go on to explain, will feature one computer, several chairs, and free coffee, plus offices for WP Chamber of Commerce and local realtors and builders, so that people can “learn” about all Winter Park has to offer, thus fulfilling the City’s promise to make the building a place of “learning” for the community.

    Reply
  10. Forest Gray Michael says:

    PEER REVIEW – Unfulfilled Referendum Program As Promised Voters

    Timely observations former Commissioner Peter Gottfried. Ok all good neighbors, taxpayers and voters, is it time to PUNT* yet or should we wait another two months when many more Millions have been spent. Is this increasingly looking like an ill-managed expenditure of our large $30 Million budget to you? I suggest to cease work and stop spending the bond funds since there is ample cause for an official and professional programmatic/design Peer Review now. Consider:

    PUNT* the architectural team is being dearly paid for design documents for a promised 50,000 sq. ft. library-events center but now is only designing ~34,700 sq. ft. This substantially less and the “too small” library contradicts the city’s and library nonprofit’s promise to voters and “our children.” So, does our city receive a refund for the lost ~16,000 sq. ft. the architectural team is not designing? STOP until we do.

    PUNT* the city and consultant representatives “managing” the delivery of this lost 50,000 sq. ft. library program. They are now telling us the geotechnical bores are causing major changes in the plan (Not acceptable at this late date). The design is way over-budget – weak management by all. What about stormwater? And BTW bond payers/taxpayers, no parking structure for you like the city referendum and Municipal Securities Rulemaking Board authorized, but perhaps the long walks will do you good!

    PUNT* the English lord’s unrealistic (High $$) design is definitely not traditional Winter Park. And where is the basic ecological sustainability in this design, LEEDS, as is expected in Florida for lower energy bills…?

    PUNT* the Library Task Force’s recommendation to “re-brand” Martin Luther King, Jr. Park to “The Canopy” is another gentrified jab at the historic 1881 Hannibal Square African American community. In 1955 our own City of Winter Park forcibly (A shame) took the land for the MLK, Jr. Park by eminent domain from African Americans who lived there since 1881, for park purposes, not for a public library. Our generation should not bear the historic burden of this latest re-branding slight on Hannibal.

    PUNT* and let’s not “take 8%” vs the 1% promised, of the MLK parkland and let’s not kill those 20-30 large oaks and other trees and wildlife in our beloved Martin Luther King, Jr. Park that we and the State of Florida paid so dearly for (BTW city, it is contractually illegal to rip up State FDEP FRDAP legally funded park trees).

    NO GREAT RUSH

    FOCUS on the Public Library square footage and a garage structure like the bond promised. STOP all outgoing payments to consultants before it’s too late. Obviously, the costs at MLK Park, a former landfill, are unanticipated and beyond the programmed bond budget, and the sinkhole-oriented site is not sustainable. Who knew. Let’s consider a new architectural team to redesign the Public Library on the CURRENT DOWNTOWN SITE for 45-50,000 sq. ft. “for our children and adults” as promised, and just update the existing civic center which is really just fine for now. Keep the English lord’s fanciful design out of it please. And the current site is “high and dry” and not near a sinkhole.

    Act on a Peer Review by relevant Commission appointed leaders – Now please – and no potential buyers of the city’s library site (Don’t include ever-expanding nearby college employees, Winter Park developers, etc.).

    *PUNT – What smart teams do when forward progress ends, like going from ~50,000 SF to ~37,000 SF…)

    Reply
  11. Cassandra says:

    The intent all along was for Rollins to get our library’s location to expand the Alfond and its parking lot. The task force was heavily loaded with people with Rollins’ connections. The town was hood winked into thinking that we were in dire need of a new library. There are many levels of deception here.

    Reply
    • Sally Flynn says:

      Who is paying attention to this Library debacle?

      Seriously,it is time for some attorneys to step up and challenge the

      breach of the Certificate of Official Statement.

      I want to quote Maggie Devane because what she wrote is so

      accurate and needs to be printed again. “We deserve to have the

      BASIC PROMISES about the project’s size, imprint on green

      space and parking made correct before ground breaking as

      approved by the voters”. To ask this seems very reasonable.

      Certainly, it is premature to talk about “branding”.

      I still believe some are listening and will do the right thing for

      the citizens…Winter Park citizens, I mean.

      Reply
  12. Where Are The Donors? says:

    We were told that the new library had strong community support.

    So where are the donors? Where are all the people lined up to make donations to the new library? Shouldn’t it be easy to attract donations with so many supporters?

    Why all the secrecy in the fundraising process?

    Could it be that there is not as much support for the new library as we have been led to believe? Could it be that’s why there is no public bidding process for naming rights for the new library that would show everyone clearly how many (or how few) supporters this project actually has in Winter Park? Could it be that they are planning to award naming rights to a favored crony, because a public auction for naming rights might draw an embarrassing few number of bidders due to lack of community support for the project?

    5,416 is how many Winter Park residents we were told voted in favor of the $30 million library bond in 2016. In a city with as many wealthy people as Winter Park, it would seem that, with this much reported public support, that a public bidding process for library naming rights would yield more dollars raised for the library than the back room deal they are cooking up now. That is, of course, if the 5,416 votes were were told were cast in favor of the new library was the true and factual number of votes cast in favor. The government would never lie to us about anything having to do with the new library – would they?

    Reply
    • Fundraising Sinkhole says:

      The Library Board Chairman announced at the City Commission meeting today that the Library, two years after the bond was approved, has not raised even half of what they had committed to.

      The Chairman did not specify how much raised to date is in cash versus pledges. Nor did she state the number of individuals donating.

      So, the answer to the question appears to be there is nowhere near the amount of community support for this project that we were led to believe existed.

      Two years later and 100% of the Library fundraising goal is not on hand in in cash money yet? Not even close?

      Wake up people. We’ve been had. 5,416 “Yes” votes? B.S.

      Reply
      • Smoke and Mirrors says:

        Because they did not say how much “raised” for the new Library to date was in cash and how much is “pledges,” assume 10% is cash.

        You really can’t count pledges because anyone can “pledge” anything. Until its cash in the bank it really shouldn’t count.

        She said $1,200,000 has been “raised”for the new Library that includes both cash and pledges. So, an educated guess would be that $120,000 has been raised – in cash.

        That’s about 12 gifts of $1,000 each, folks, or 6 gifts of $2,000 each, or 3 gifts of $4,000 each.

        So, we can estimate that about 12 people (or fewer) in town favor the new library project enough to make a significant cash contribution to it. Twelve out of a population of 30,000. And that’s giving the benefit of the doubt that the donors are Winter Park residents and aren’t from out of town. Could be fewer than 12 Winter Park residents who have made a significant commitment.

        These are estimates of course, trying to “fill in the blanks” from the sketchy details about fundraising provided to the Commission by the Library chairman.

        There’s no way 5,416 people, in a prosperous town, voted for a new library, and only 12 are willing to step up to make a significant financial contribution.

        The statement that 5,416 was the number of residents who voted in favor of the Library bond, makes no sense mathematically, anecdotally, or logically. But 5,416 is what we are being told by our government was they number of votes that caused the Library bond vote to narrowly pass on Election Day.

        The City Commission appears to be pursuing a project that has no significant resident support, and has NEVER had any significant resident support.

        Reply
  13. S.L.James says:

    Many are aware of the misrepresentations presented by our recent mayors and their ilk and for the questionable need for the library move in the first place, except to gain more adjacent space for Rollins and provide ill gain for many promoters.

    It continues the political spin and travesty fostered upon innocent or otherwise uninformed Winter Park citizens over the years. In addition to “follow the muck,” one need only follow the money (which indeed is not always evident) to see why we have become the city that has replaced trees and green space with concrete.

    The Winter Park Voice is a refreshing voice in an otherwise murky environment. Its factual reporting needs to be heard by more citizens so they may make an informed choice…not just one based on slick political presentations. Hopefully we could elect officials with more of an interest in guiding our community responsibly and honestly rather than for personal gain.

    Perhaps more of us need to lend dollar-support to good journalism that eschews today’s prevalent “fake”news.

    Good reporting needs a greater audience…it is one of few checks on the actions of elected officials. Many folks will take the time to read a well-researched and -written article than they would to get “involved” in the political arena.

    Thank you for an excellent, well-presented article! i will be donating to your welcome efforts.

    Reply
    • Feet In City Hall says:

      Can attend City Commission meetings. Fill up the room at every meeting. Line up a the public comment microphone. Speak your mind. Keep going until Winter Park residents regain control of their City Commission.

      Reply
  14. Peter Gottfried says:

    For those of you who agree that this “Canopy” Library/Event Center/Parking Structure is one of the biggest boondoggles in Winter Park history, i invite you to write your concerns to the State Attorney’s office – 9th Circuit. This Circuit wrote the opinion when the location was originally challenged that the ancillary documents sent by the city to voters clearly established the MLK Park as the proper location for the new library. Using this logic, we can assume that ancillary documents sent prior to the bond vote clearly established at 50,000 square foot library and parking garage with 220-240 spaces. Please write to Ms. Kamilah Perry at the address below.

    Kamilah L. Perry, Esquire
    Executive Director / General Counsel
    Office of Aramis D. Ayala
    State Attorney, Ninth Judicial Circuit
    415 N. Orange Avenue
    Orlando, FL 32801
    407.836.2156 Office
    407.694.6430 Cellular
    kperry@sao9.org

    Reply
    • Peter Gottfried says:

      In addition, you can file a complaint with the SEC Office of Municipal Securities https://www.sec.gov/whistleblower/submit-a-tip This takes about 10 minutes. One question on the form is what ‘Firm’ are you reporting. I entered the City of Winter Park. The bonds are known as City of Winter Park General Obligation Bonds, Series 2017. I encourage you to file a tip/complaint.

      Reply
      • Anne Mooney says:

        CORRECTION: The bonds are known as City of Winter Park General Obligation Bonds, Series 2016 [N.B. 2016].

        Reply
    • "I'm from the government and I'm here to help" says:

      Let me get this straight.

      You’re going to ask the government, to stop the government from ripping off your park?

      Asking help from the government will get you only so far.

      And it didn’t work out so well for MLK Park the last time you tried.

      Awakening THIRTY THOUSAND Winter Park residents to the coming heist of their only decent sized park, has a greater probability of success.

      Where are the yard signs to save MLK Park?

      Where are they?

      Where are the mailers to every Winter Park resident to let them know what is really going on?

      Where are the people who will get on the phone and walk door to door to tell their neighbors that their park is on the verge of being COMPLETELY developed before long, and that whatever the real purpose of what they are building in the park that they are telling us will be a library is only their first step?

      Where are the people who will lead 50, 100, 500, a thousand, or more residents to City Hall EVERY WEEK until they stop?

      There are more of us then there are of them.

      Never forget that.

      Reply

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